polls and contracts
By Jeff
the votes are in My preseason poll, based upon you, my loyal readers, is as follows: Utah State;UH;New Mexico State;Nevada;Fresno;San Jose State;Idaho; and La Tech. My vote had Nevada second and UHthird, and Idaho 5 th and Fresno 7th, but the readers rule.
What's going on with Gib"s contract? It's only been 6 months since the season ended.. Lots of discussion on the supposed terms. Too much money ( 345,000)? Three years vrs five years? Yet, here we are days away from the official start of practice in year two, and still no written agreement.
Hard to figure out who will be the loser if this goes on much longer. The coach, who might not win 19 games this year , or UH, who may find itself with a coach sought out by bigger name schools if he has another successful year.
I am interested in your thoughts. Is 345,000 too much for a coach who only has one year under his belt when you consider Riley never made more than 225,000 and the volleyball and baseball coaches dont make anywhere near that. or is the right amount for a coach who won 19 games, brought back fans to the program, and would still not be the top pay for a WAC Basketball Coach ( i think it would place him third)?
And is three years too little or 5 years too much? Gib told me that the length of his contract is very important to recruiting and stability. Others say 5 years is too long and is unrealistic for a coach with only one year under his belt. Who do you think is to blame for the current status of the contract. A coach who is asking for too much or an Administrationthat does not appear to see any urgency in getting the job done? or maybe you think both sides have to share the blame/ Or maybe they are seconds away from a deal and there is no issue?
Tonight on Hoops Talk, Jackson and i will be discussing these issues in detail and hope to hear from you here and on the air. 7:30 on ESPN 1420. 296-1420.
Hoops Talk
October 11th, 2011 at 8:40 pm
The proposed Gib deal is too long and too much money.
Can we let the guy prove himself before we commit the program to him?
Maybe he gets an A for drawing interest in the program from players who would normally not look to playing in Hawaii. But drawing interest is just the start. Two guys have already left. Several guys did not get into school. The recruiting seemed to be a mess. At this point, D.
19 wins, but how many games are attributed to Amis coming back for another year, and to Miah, who appeared out of nowhere to revitalize the team. Without those two guys, the win total might have been cut in half, in which event no one would be talking long term contract for big dollars. It may have been sheer dumb luck.
I want to see more before I am a believer, and to see more, I am not willing to commit long term or big dollars.
October 11th, 2011 at 8:56 pm
Coach Mac had 0 years under his belt and was offered a 5 year deal. It doesn't take years to determine if a coach like Gib has it or not. But it might not matter anyway. Two more winning seasons, and, hopefully, post-season games, somebody's going to grab him and make him an offer he can't refuse. Pay the assistant coaches decent money instead. That way, when Gib is gone, you can then promote one of the assistants to head coach. Learn from your mistakes, U.H. If you have an associate coach in the same position for 20 years, he is not head coaching material. Something to nosh on...
October 11th, 2011 at 11:34 pm
its too much money. and not long enough. should be $290-300,000 a year for five years. length of the contract seems more important to Gib than the money. the fault for all of this lies with upper campus for not having a contract settled before the season began, or even before it ended.
October 12th, 2011 at 8:26 am
I think the UH got lucky and has an up and coming star of a coach fall into their laps and in my opinion is looking at the long term health of the basketball program. After listening to Coach Gib's radio interview his biggest concern seemed to be having a contract long enough to tell a recruit that he will be his coach for his entire stay at the UH. He also brought up the fact that two other former assistant basketball coaches were just hired this year as head coaches by WAC schools and were given 5 year contracts. If the athletic department can't keep Gib here we should be looking for another AD who is proactive with a vision for the future of UH sports.
October 12th, 2011 at 8:53 am
too much money and too long for to short a time. Bonus for the luck of having Miah, available last year.
Unproven as the on court coach, my point is still last season's San Francisco game, I still believe that the coach lost the game, not the players, players are helpless, if they are on the bench or instructied not to rebound by being taken off the foul lanes. Coach refuses to elaborate on his decision to pull the players from the line. This seems to say, three year contract, renegoiate after two successfull years equals five years. Contract must have "leave early penalty clause".
Last Question, watching the video of the China trip, I noticed Mr Arnold(Frank) in the hotel lobby. My Question is was Frank Arnold an EMPLOYEE(free trip) or did he, himself pay for the trip???
October 12th, 2011 at 2:15 pm
These comments are ridiculous.
The poster Lava gives him a "D" on the recruiting class. Ridiculous. The class has brought in Shaquile Stokes who was the New York City player of the year, had multiple BCS conference offers, and who averaged over 20 a game on the Asia trip. We haven't had this type of talented prospect in years - and we may never have had as talented a frosh decide to come here. Brereton was a JUCO All-American to which we beat out BYU for. Standhardinger is a high-major transfer that will likely be a starter next year. And Jawato and Jefferson are solid mid-major prospects with time to grow in the program (frosh, and soph). In the entire Nash/Riley era, I don't think there has been this type of a mixture of talent and youth.
Not giving a five year deal is counter-productive. Both new coaches in the WAC this year (La Tech and Fresno) both got 5 year deals. 5 years is industry standard. It allows the coach to organize and plan his regime for the longer term rather than just to win immeidately.
345,000 is the amount that has been reported in the paper - but the paper also mentioned that private donors are covering a portion of that increase. That concept - in and of itself - is proof that the program is energized and going in the right direction. Over the last 23 years, either of those coaches inspired enough to get the community to mobilize to support their endeavors and vision.
Your comparissons to Volleyball and Baseball coaches are specious and you know it. Dave is worth every penny he earns, but he has to be amongst the highest paid volleyball coaches in the country. He is at the very top of his industry's pay-scale.
Same goes for baseball. It is generally not a revenue sport, and so any comparisson between relative salaries in those sports make little sense.
And worse, become misleading if you just compare dollar figures. Come on Jeff, less compare apples to apples here.
October 12th, 2011 at 6:13 pm
hey rainbow for life. lighten up a little. dont accuse me of making statements i never made. i was just pointing out the pros and cons that have appeared in print and in the blogs and asking folks to weigh in. Based on last year's comments, i know you are a big Gib Arnold fan and that's great. But dont misquote me or put words in my mouth. When i have an opinion, you will know it and can agree or disagree. If you have listened to my show, you know i have no problem with the rumored salary. But its no shock to you or anyone else that there are other views out there.
October 12th, 2011 at 10:45 pm
5 years with incentives is doable, some booster or corporations and boosters will pay some of the salary, UH has to stay within a affordable budget ,I would think Gib and his legal advisor would know that and not try to rip our athletic budget.
October 13th, 2011 at 10:29 am
Jeff, why would you ask me to lighten up a little? You requested input in your blog on your following statement:
"I am interested in your thoughts. Is 345,000 too much for a coach who only has one year under his belt when you consider Riley never made more than 225,000 and the volleyball and baseball coaches dont make anywhere near that. or is the right amount for a coach who won 19 games, brought back fans to the program, and would still not be the top pay for a WAC Basketball Coach ( i think it would place him third)?"
In your own words, you are asking wheking whether the reportedly proposed salary for Arnold of $345,000 is "too much for a coach" considering the fact that "the volleyball and baseball coaches don't make anywhere near that."
I pointed out that your comparission is specious because volleyball and baseball are not traditional revenue sports, so the respective salary ranges within those industries are completely different from men's basketball. Dave Shoji - at $190,000 a year deserves every penny he gets and is amongst the highest paid volleyball coaches in the nation.
That's why I'm throwing a flag at your game, and saying if you are going to make a comparisson compare apples to apples.
Perhaps a more reasonable way of framing your question would be: Is 345,000 to Arnold (with some of it picked up by private boosters) "too much" after a 19 win first year, increase in attendance of approx. 40%, and substantial increase in team revenue, and first post-season appearance in 7 years, the successful planning/financing/completinon of a first-ever an Asia goodwill trip in a 5 month period, and just this week being named one of the "5 top First-Year Hires" in all of college basketball by Athlon Sports College Basketball Preview (along with Dan Altman, Steve Lavin, and Danny Hurley),
when compared to Fresno St. giving Rodney Terry a $350,000, 5 year deal, with this being Terry's first head coaching position ever, or perhaps to whatever the new La Tech head coach is making - who also got a five year deal.